Recent Post With SANE's Guidelines On Discussing Suicide

[chibam]

Disclaimer (as requested): I am not about to do the s-word.

@Jynx , thank you for your recent post explaining SANE's guidelines for discussing suicide. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to reply to that post directly, so I've just started a new thread. I hope that's okay?

I'm a bit confused/concerned that there was one major aspect of discussing suicide that the post didn't seem to offer any clarification on: how to discuss the fates we considder to be less desirable then death.

This has been the area that has probably given me the most trouble and confusion during my time on the SANE forums, and has been behind the majority of post deletions and/or moderator reediting that I've experianced here.

I don't see how we can have productive discussions about where we are right now, the prospect of suicide, and how to forge a path to somewhere that is better then either of those situations, if we are unable to clarify what we considder to be a less desirable situation then suicide, and to calmly and clearly defend that viewpoint if it is questioned by someone else.

If I state my case in a manner such as: "My life is [situation A]. I'd be better off d**d then living like this.", and somebody responded: "Well, if you just do such-and-such, you could change your [situation A] to [situation B] or [situation C].", shouldn't I have the right to clarify to that person that I considder the alternatives they've offered to also be less desirable then suicide? Otherwise, how can we have a productive conversation?

Maybe I've misunderstood the concept of "Recovery Focussed Posting", but as I understand the concept, being open and earnest about fates that are worse then death does not necessarily go against a recovery focus. Instead, it actually helps us to build a recovery focus, by allowing us to clarify precisely what "recovery" means.

To me, "recovery" means getting to an outcome that is actually better then suicide; which means that we need to be able to clarify what we each considder to be the outcomes we considder to be worse then suicide, as we will all have different ideas about what these situations are.

Saying "I'd be better off d**d then ending up in [situation A], [situation B], [situation C]" is not a denial that I might be able to reach situations D, E, or F, which I considder to be more desirable then suicide. It is merely a clarification of the things I consider to be less desirable options then suicide, which is often something that needs to be done, in order to have productive conversations that can lead us to getting the correct help we need in order to reach our situations D, E, or F.

Unfortunately, clarifying and defending our views on the fates we consider to be worse then death has always been pretty precarious here on the SANE forums, and can often lead to post deletion or signficant post sensorship.

I've always found it hard to determine precisely what the rules are in this regard.

Do you think it might be helpful to clarify them in your post?

[GraceFalling]

Hi, haven't been here for a long while and not sure this is right thread to post to or if this is appropriate content, please vet before posting.

I have lived with a suicide ideology for since seven years old. Part of a Complex PTSD. I had the usual mostly inadequate and down right dangerous interactions with mental health. 

The upshot is that I had to take charge of my mental health myself and develop my own suicide prevention plan. It has worked for me for the past 15 years with a lot of immediate delay periods in there. This does not stop me from having a suicide ideology and I have liver damage and an optic nerve stroke from previous attempts. What is does help delay is the actual attempts through using a gradually increasing series of delay techniques based on getting a good life balance (for me that is creative, intellectual and physical components) while getting rid of the stressors I have some control over.

I don't know if it will help anyone else or not, but it may start you thinking along different lines. Both for those who are suicidal and those who live with or know them. 

Hopefully the graphic is readable, if not, and someone wants clearer info I can post again just in writing. The visual just gives you a better idea of how cyclic the process is. At the moment I am doing a mix of a medium length delay, making beaded curtains for my flat; and a 4 year long term delay which is getting my black belt in karate.

[tyme]

Thank you for sharing @GraceFalling .

When you click on the diagram, you can zoom in and read the content. Is this diagram something you have created based on your own experiences?

I found it very relatable.

[GraceFalling]

Yes. I developed it over a number of years. Haven't had to tweak it for the past 15 though.

[GraceFalling]

Thanks for the tip about clicking on it.